Spotlight on Jessica Taylor

BY CARA SCHAEFER

While you might know Jessica Taylor as Out There’s Advertising Manager, she’s also an adventurer and outdoorswoman in her own right! We spoke with her about living life on the road in her R-Pod travel trailer, traveling with her chihuahua mix, Foxy, and having confidence in yourself through the unexpected. 

Photo courtesy of Jessica Taylor.

OUT THERE: How did you decide to take on a more mobile lifestyle?

JESSICA TAYLOR: I've always loved traveling. I've always loved being out in nature. I feel like it's a really healthy place for me to be. And so I thought, ‘I'm not married. I don't have kids. I have the freedom.’ I was working for myself, so I could work fully remote on my laptop. And so I said, “Why not? Nothing's really holding me back.” And I headed out on the road in February of 2020.

OT: Do you have a favorite memory from life on the road so far?

JT: Oh, that's hard! Last year I did a canoeing trip in Montana for seven days on the Missouri River. That was a pretty exciting experience.

OT: What was the highlight of the trip for you?

JT: I brought my drone. I was taking it up to get a really beautiful sunset shot up on a really high ridge above us, and it crashed up there. The sun was setting and I knew immediately if I'm going to get this, I need to go get it now, because we're leaving super early the next morning. So I went hiking up this cliff at dusk. By the time I found it, it was dark. Then I had to make a decision if I was going to go three different routes. 

My family didn't know where I was, and so I was trying to think, ‘What do I feel most comfortable with? If I got hurt, how would my family be able to find me as quick as possible?’ I could either go one really long way, which is the way I came up, but at the same time I felt like my family wouldn't know to look for me there. The second way was new, so I didn't really know what was there. And the third way was just going straight down the face of the cliff. 

I was able to yell to my family from far away — it was kind of echoey — but I let them know l was okay. Then I turned on my light so that they could see where I was at, and I headed straight down the face of the cliff. There was a golden eagle feather that I found up at the very top, and I put the feather in my hair. It was this cool moment of, “You are capable. You can do this. You are strong.” Just believing in myself. I made it to the bottom, and my mom gave me a big hug. She was thankful I was safe. I still have that feather. 

OT: What are some of the pros and cons of life on the road? 

JT: Pros: You get to see a lot of new sights. You get to meet a lot of new people. It gets you out of your comfort zone, but also helps you gain confidence in yourself, and that you're capable of being able to do things on your own. And problem solving! You learn a lot of problem solving with a travel trailer. It's like a little mini earthquake every time you're moving it, so things break pretty regularly. You educate yourself on how to fix things, to save money.

Cons are it gets a little lonely sometimes. Thankfully, I have my dog with me all the time, so I'm never completely alone. It gets a little lonely though if I want to talk to somebody, or build up a relationship with them. Virtually I have a community, but it's different to be with people in person. 

OT: Since you travel with such an absolutely adorable dog, if Foxy was in charge for one day, where would you go and what would you do there?

JT: We would go hiking. That would be her thing. Some of my best memories with her, where she was just so happy, was in Colorado when we were hiking these 14,000-foot mountains. She just absolutely loved it. She trekked along, and although it'd be freezing cold, she would just keep going. It's almost like she's a work dog at heart when we're on the trail.

OT: What do you wish someone would have told you about traveling with a dog?

JT: A lot of national parks don't allow you to go on some of the backroad trails with a dog. It's interesting though, I've never been at a point where it's like, “Oh, bummer. I'm here at Yellowstone and I can't go exploring because of my dog.” If anything, I think it's better to have my travel trailer because she can sit in it. It doesn't cook like a car, so I can turn fans on, leave the windows open, keep it cool in there for Foxy, and she's happy to just hang out in the trailer if I go somewhere. 

It’s also helpful to come up with a plan of how you're going to be able to work when it's really hot. If it's 100 degrees out, I definitely can't leave her in the trailer. It can be difficult on the road to find someplace that you can be inside where there's air conditioning and WiFi, but where you can also have a dog. That's a hurdle that usually takes some extra time to figure out.

This interview has been edited for brevity and clarity.

You can find Jessica on Instagram or at her website.

Spotlight on Kimberly Wheatley

BY CARA SCHAEFER

Splashing and singing just might be the key to a more joyous life. We spoke with solo kayaker and explorer Kimberly Wheatley about paddling, self-care, and kayak karaoke.

Photos courtesy of Kimberly Wheatley.

OUT THERE: What got you started on paddling?

KIMBERLY WHEATLEY: I've always had a love for the water. In 2015 I took a trip to Canada to go kayaking with orcas. I didn’t know what I was doing — I hadn't paddled before — but I was like, “Sure I can paddle for six hours straight a day. No problem.” I absolutely loved it, and just did not have a way to start kayaking on my own. I lived in an apartment in Los Angeles, and so there was no place to store a kayak, not to mention I had no one to kayak with. 

It wasn't until about three years later that I bought my Oru Kayak, after seeing it on Shark Tank as I was recovering from foot surgery. And so on a whim I bought this kayak, and almost immediately regretted it. I was like, “Okay, you're not going to go. Who are you going to go with? You don’t even know how to kayak. You’ve never kayaked by yourself.” And then I ended up buying it, and forced myself to use it that first couple of times. I immediately was hooked, and it changed my life.

OT: If you could go back to one moment out on the water, what would it be? 

KW: It would have to be my paddle on Bow Lake in Canada. It was absolutely stunning. I had the entire lake to myself. I just remember kayaking over these ginormous boulders that were under the water, that you couldn't possibly see from the shore. It was such a cool perspective to see what you’re kayaking over. They were sitting there in the Canadian Rockies in this water that's this, not even turquoise blue, but this beautiful hue of blue. I remember thinking to myself, ‘You know, if I were to die today like right now, I would not be upset that this is the last thing that I saw.’

OT: You mentioned that you’ve always been drawn to water. Why do you think that is?

KW: When I was a kid, “The Little Mermaid” was my absolute favorite movie. I saw it when it first came out. I never had the chance to really get on the water, until I had a kayak. And now there's just this calming feeling. I could sit in the middle of the ocean all day, and just stare out.

I don't know if it's just this feeling of being so small, because when you're on the water, even a whale in the water is minuscule. And that's a crazy feeling to me. Your problems seem so big sometimes, but in actuality the water is such a big reminder that you're actually really small. And just to kind of keep that perspective sometimes when I start freaking out about things. I love scuba diving. I love kayaking. There's something about being around water that just puts me at ease, and takes me out of my head.

OT: You mentioned scuba diving, what are the differences for you? From being on top of the water to being under the water?

KW: The thing I like about scuba diving is, like so many things in life, your mind is really good at conjuring up this idea of what's really happening. And so when you're on the water, there's this vulnerability that is there because you're just imagining what's underneath you, like ‘Oh there's probably something scary out there.’ Then you get to scuba dive, and suddenly you can see that ‘Oh, so there aren't just a bunch of sharks down here waiting to eat me.’ It's just opening your mind to a whole different world. And they are two different worlds — what goes on above the water, and what goes on below the water are a different universe.

OT: What's the coolest thing you've seen while scuba diving?

KW: My biggest thing would probably be when I got to scuba dive at night with manta rays. I think that was one of the most amazing experiences of my entire life, to be underwater with these majestic creatures as they just kind of somersaulted through the water at night. Literally their wingspan is about 15 feet. And they're just gliding above you, eating the plankton at night. I just felt so privileged to be able to have witnessed that. When I watch my video from that day, it still gives me chills. And I'm terrified of the ocean at night. I don’t know how I managed to jump in the ocean and descend to the floor, but to scuba dive, I was like, “I'm going to do it.” I faced that fear, and it was one of the most memorable experiences. 

OT: How is paddling a form of self-care for you?

KW: I feel the older you get, the more I have friends that have relied on “Oh, I’m single. Life is so bad.” And all these things that are tied into someone else making you happy, and not enough energy being put out like “Okay, well how do you figure out what makes you happy? Independent of any other human being, what makes you happy?” 

And for me, that's kayaking. I can create my own happiness that's completely independent of anybody else. So if I'm having a bad day, or if I'm feeling stressed out at work, I know that what’s going to reset me is to be on an isolated lake somewhere, paddling for hours. I feel like a completely different person. It's just me, the water, the trees, silence — it literally just reinvigorates my entire existence. It provides a mental clarity, because I can have time to think.There’s a calmness and quietness that I get from being on the water that I haven't found a way to get anywhere else.

Even if I don't want to go out, because kayaking, it is work — packing up my car, and putting my kayak together. It's one of those things where it's almost like going to the gym. No matter how much work it took me mentally to get there, when I'm there I always feel better. There's never a time where kayaking leaves me feeling anything other than fulfilled.

OT: If you got to automatically add two songs to your friend’s kayaking playlist, what would they be?

KW: One of them would definitely be “Way Less Sad” by AJR because I love that song. And then the second song would probably be something from “The Greatest Showman” like “This Is Me”. That’s one where if I’m having a long paddle, and I’m like “Oh goodness, I really got a long way back to go.” I'll just put that on, and paddle and sing along to the beat, and use that as my motivation to keep going. There’s something about that empowering king of song that says “Yeah you got this!”

This interview has been edited for brevity and clarity.

You can find Kimberly on Instagram and online at Duct Tape Diaries.

Let's get to know each other!

Dearest listeners,

I’ve been producing Out There for almost seven years. And the show has grown and changed a lot over that time. But one thing has stayed the same: YOU are my number-one priority. I make Out There for you, and because of you. And I’m so grateful that you choose to share your time with us!

In order to produce stories that make a real difference in your life, my team and I would like to get to know you better. Would you be so kind as to fill out the survey below?

To thank you for your time, when you complete the survey, I will:

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— Willow and the Out There team

Spotlight on SUSTAIN

BY CARA SCHAEFER

Can you look great, live life to the fullest, and help the planet doing so? We spoke with Reza Cristián, founder and editor-in-chief of SUSTAIN, about eco-conscious fashion and normalizing a more sustainable lifestyle. 

Photos courtesy of Reza Cristián.

OUT THERE: So for those who have never read SUSTAIN before, what is all about?

REZA CRISTÁN: SUSTAIN is a grassroots online media publication that is essentially trying to shift the narrative of sustainability and environmental justice in media, and make it more inclusive in a way that is very fun, unique, and budget-friendly for all ages.

OT: Where did the idea for the magazine come from?

RC: I love magazines. I grew up reading all the teeny-bopper fashion magazines and books. I come from a Mexican-American Hispanic household, so when I went to school for journalism I wanted to change what I saw growing up on these magazines. You know, everyone wasn't as diverse. I feel like some of the things I would read, you'd have to have money to buy these certain types of products within magazines like Teen Vogue or Seventeen. 

When I went to college, I started learning about the word “sustainability” and what it really meant. I realized I had these types of ideas and lifestyle hacks growing up, but I didn't really know that I was being environmentally friendly. Like my family and I would reuse Ziploc bags and containers, and reuse the plastic spoons from the Yogurtland near my house. And once I realized what sustainability was, and how bad fast fashion was, I then saw that there weren't many sustainability or environmental justice magazines. We wanted to create something that was fully about this topic and all the intersections around it, and then just normalize it. This was back in 2017, so at the time it was still a new thing for a lot of people. At least in the mainstream — of course, it wasn't new for cultures and communities that had been doing it for years. 

OT: Do you have a favorite piece that SUSTAIN magazine has put out?

RC: I love them all, but a recent one I really like is by Gunjan Nanda. She has written about sustainability in gaming — she’s a gamer herself — and how we could become more eco-conscious within the gaming world, and how the gaming industry itself can be more sustainable. 

OT: What does living a sustainable lifestyle look like for you personally?

RC: For me, it's not only my little everyday tasks, but trying to reduce my carbon footprint. And also making sure I question the practices of corporations that I may either buy into, or I feel the need to buy into. I try to avoid big corporations like Amazon. If I have to buy anything, it's small businesses for sure. Then of course, just trying to educate myself on different topics within the sustainable space. It's always changing, and there's always something to learn and unlearn. It’s trying to do the best we can with our own life, but understanding that we don't have to be perfect as well. There's many ways to be having that lifestyle, and it looks different for everyone.

OT: Is there anything you wish more people knew about sustainable living?

RC: I wish more people knew that they don't have to buy their way into it. I think a lot of people still have that notion that they need to do everything perfectly, and they need to buy their way into it, like purchasing all the new sustainable products that come out from startups and brands. 

I think people need to understand that it’s baby steps, but at the same time to educate themselves about the policies, like how corporations and our governments maybe help — or hurt — the environment. How we could, as citizens, fix that and try really hard to make a difference that way. So it's not just blaming consumers, but it's also placing blame on the larger corporations. I think it's a balance, and people are trying to figure that out. Some people still feel like it's just about loving Earth. And yes, it is, but it's about loving the people as well. 

OT: When it comes to fashion, how has your style, and where you get your clothes from, evolved over time?

RC: Definitely thrifting! I only thrift right now. If I get any clothing, it's usually from small brands that I like or from friends' closets. My style has evolved into what I would call more quality pieces, because when I thrift I want to find pieces that will last. When you thrift, you can find all types of things. You can find fast fashion secondhand, which is still great. But I try to stick to more quality pieces, because I want whatever I purchase and put on my body to last a long time, so I don't have to end up throwing it into the landfills. Also, my style has evolved to be more colorful. In the past, I feel like I was wearing more neutrals, and now I wear a lot of colors. And a lot of relaxing clothes. 

OT: What is the one thing in your closet that you love to wear over and over again?

RC: Right now they're my mom jeans. I got them this year at a pop-up thrift shop. They’re actually men's jeans, so they are kind of big — I have to wear a belt. They're so soft. Even though they're like thick mom jeans, I absolutely love them. I probably wear them almost every day. I only have a few pairs of jeans, and I always stick to the ones that make me feel the best!

OT: How can someone create a more sustainable wardrobe of their own?

RC: I would say find the basics that you  really want or love. First find things that can be versatile, things that you can kind of switch around and create multiple outfits with. You don't have to feel the pressure of buying all the trends. Like right now with shoes the trend is these very slick, Bratz-type shoes. I see them on platforms like Instagram all the time. Maybe instead of going to a trendy Bratz shoe that Steven Madden might be selling, you can purchase a black pair of boots at a thrift store, and have that in your closet. It will still be very relevant to the trends that are happening. If you buy these types of  basics that you can always use, they're never going to go out of style. They'll always keep up with the trends, and the new versions of these trends. Only purchase what you think you will be wearing years down the line.

This interview has been edited for brevity and clarity.

You can find SUSTAIN magazine at their website or on Instagram. You can find Reza on Instagram. To see Gunjan Nanda’s article on eco-conscious gaming click here.

Spotlight on Jam Doughty

BY CARA SCHAEFER

From ice crystals to backyard noises to beetles, art can be a great way to process what you observe. We spoke with Jam Doughty, a Chicago-based artist, about zine making, urban invertebrates, and how to make your own nature zine.

Photos courtesy of Jam Doughty.

OUT THERE: For those who aren't familiar with the term, what is a “zine”?

JAM DOUGHTY: It's short for magazine. It started out as a personally Xeroxed, manually cut and pasted, little fan zine. Some of the first zines were science fiction fanfiction zines in the 60s. Most of the first ones were actually written by women who weren't allowed to really participate in science fiction, and so they were making their own fanzines about Kirk and Spock.

OT: What got you into making zines?

JD: I actually come from a family of zine makers. My grandparents made zines in the 80s. I've always been inspired by their work, like my grandpa would make rubber stamp zines and all these cool mail art zines, and had a system of pen pals — kind of like a mailing list that he would use. My grandma also made a recipe and poetry zine, and my mom would make zines with her friends in high school. I didn't start making zines until I moved to Chicago four years ago. Before that I grew up in Washington State.

OT: What was that transition like?

JD: I have really enjoyed it. I wanted to live in a different ecosystem, specifically an urban ecosystem. Although I can't just go out in my backyard and stroll through the woods as easily, I do feel like I'm experiencing just as much weird nature here.  And it's just so much more densely packed and human adapted.

OT: How was it that nature began to play a role in your zine making?

JD: The impetus for me making zines was observing the urban nature interaction. My first one was of snow crystals during my first winter here, because I'd never seen that diamond dust snow before. So I drew a bunch of different snow crystal formations. And then my next few zines were about winter textures in the city, plants in hibernation, plant detritus caught in city grates and bricks and stuff...I was just really obsessed with all of the textures of winter. Even though it's really tough. I mean, everything is dead over the winter.

OT: What nature do you tend to notice walking around the city of Chicago, and has anything you observed surprised you?

JD: All the time! I am a plant person. I really love looking at the ways that plants find any niche that they possibly can in a city and take advantage of it. I love watching like, “Oh, nobody pulled this weed a few years ago, and now it's a tree  — and has completely destroyed this fence. Good job tree.” Or in some neighborhoods, we have melanistic squirrels. They’re all black and they're really cute!

OT: One of your zine series is called “City Inverts”. What's one of your favorite invertebrates from this series and why?

JD: Before the pandemic, me and my coworkers would do outdoor programming, so we would go on a lot of bug hunts. We would flip over logs, and try and find different creatures. That's where l have the most familiarity with rollie pollies, millipedes, centipedes...all of those guys. One that I didn't include in the “City Inverts”, because it is really rare and I had never seen it before, was terrestrial flatworms. They look like they should be in the Mariana Trench, like they should be far underwater.

OT: So you’ve also done zines on indoor nature. What does indoor nature mean to you?

JD: Part of my philosophy as a nature educator is to try and make nature as accessible as possible. And I think the best way to do that is to just build an awareness that you live in an ecosystem, and you're part of an ecosystem even when you're surrounded by human-made stuff.

Indoor nature journals started at the beginning of the pandemic, because I was trying to figure out something that was still nature related, but that wouldn't encourage anything that could be considered risky. I think it's important to reinvent and re-envision space, especially when you’re stuck there. I wanted to try to help kids, or whoever wanted to fill out the zines, work through their house in a more positive way, because that's something that I was really struggling with.

OT: If someone's feeling inspired after reading this, how would they go about making their own nature zine?

JD: The mini zines that I make are actually folded out of a piece of printer paper, like a single piece of eight and a half by eleven paper. And there are lots of easy guides online that will show you the folding pattern. It's pretty simple. That's part of why I like the medium so much, because it's so xeroxable.

There are so many different ways to approach it. I have one friend who instead of drawing plants in her zines, she dries them and then very carefully collages them onto the original and then Xeroxes it from that. So it's not just for drawers, you can make these however you choose. There are a lot of people who make perzines, which stands for personal zines. Those are more like diary scenes. You can even just write down all of your observations — all of your reflections after a walk through the park, or a gaze out your window. There’s leaf rubbings. You can do bark rubbings. You can draw maps. You can include any way that you process the environment that you're in. Mini zines are such a flexible medium. And if anyone feels inspired to make a zine after reading my zines and wants to do a zine swap, I am always down to trade zines!

This interview has been edited for brevity and clarity.

You can find Jam and their work online at Instagram, Patreon, and Etsy.

Spotlight on Marshall Johnson

BY CARA SCHAEFER

Can the decisions we make everyday save the prairie? We spoke with Marshall Johnson, acting Chief Conservation Officer for the National Audubon Society, about birds, learning to love grasslands, and empowering shoppers to make eco-friendly choices.

Photo courtesy of Marshall Johnson.

OUT THERE: What's one of your favorite birds and why?

MARSHALL JOHNSON: One of my favorite birds is the Western Meadowlark. I think of birds as sort of my playlists in nature — the troubadours and songstresses that fill my time in nature with sound and song. For me, I spend the most time in nature in the prairies, and that’s the ubiquitous call: the call of the Western Meadowlark. 

OT: What got you interested in birds in the first place?

MJ: I didn't really grow up as someone who was keenly aware of nature. I grew up on the blacktop — Dallas, Los Angeles. What initially got me into birds, and the environment more generally, was at some point I picked up a Hudson River School of artists book. Something about landscape art, particularly the variety that came out of that fraternity of artists, spoke to me and really attracted me to nature. I appreciated that within many of these works nature was big, and people were small — but still a part of the system. 

A group of us at the University of Minnesota Crookston, where I studied business, became really motivated and activated by environmental causes. I felt like it was something I wanted to explore more deeply, and so I moved to Fargo and started a part-time gig with the Audubon Society. I thought it would be a six-month exploration, and that was 13 years ago.

OT: What does the Audubon Society mean to you personally?

MJ: For me, the Audubon Society are the spokespeople — the ambassadors, if you will, of North America's birds. We like to say that the Audubon Society is local everywhere. And that’s true. We have 450 community chapters throughout North America (mostly in the United States), 20 state and regional offices, and 44 nature centers, many of which are located in urban areas. When you look at the 1.9 million members, and the 3 or 4 million people we connect with, it's increasingly diverse and increasingly inclusive. That's important to me, and we've got a long way to go. 

OT: Why do you think you have an affinity with grassland environments in particular?

MJ: I’m going to borrow a quote that I love: “Anyone can love the mountains, but it takes soul to love the prairie.” I grew up in a very tumultuous household as a kid, and there’s always been a calming aspect to the prairie. I felt most at peace in Western Texas, and everything that was around me then, as we were driving through or spending time there, were prairies and cows and grassland birds. It became ingrained in my DNA and my spirit.

OT: Can you tell me a bit about the Conservation Ranching Initiative?

MJ: Ninety plus percent of what remains of the historic grassland ecosystem — which once covered a vast amount of North America and has since been converted, urbanized, you name it  —  is either owned or managed by cattle ranchers. And so a group of us “rebels” within the Audubon Society, we began to think about what real, scalable conservation might look like. A lot of the tools that the grassland conservation and environmental community have been utilizing have been the same over the last 100 years: easements, acquisitions, other cost share programs. And they're very important, but when you look at the amount of loss that we're experiencing, juxtaposed to the amount conserved, there's a chasm that's emerged. 

So with that in mind, we felt that one of the most important things that we could do was raise the level and set a standard for grassland management which underscored the need to reduce chemical use, the need for regenerative, holistic range management, and the need for cattle production systems that corresponded to and blended with grassland birds and pollinators likes bees and butterflies — with what those critters need out on the landscape. We ultimately decided to create a habitat certification, the first of its kind for grass-fed beef, to empower everyday people. 

Empowering consumers with better choices is one of the most important things that we can do to address a whole range of environmental challenges, from climate change to biodiversity collapse. Every day people are making decisions, and if we can change those supply chains to be more beneficial for nature, it's incredibly powerful. Since we've launched the Conservation Ranching Initiative, on average, the ranchers that are enrolled have increased their bird abundance by nearly a third. When we can get the grasslands that we have remaining to work more, and do more for birds and wildlife, it's a win-win situation.

OT: Do you think we as people can create a better environmental future for both birds and ourselves?

MJ: I think we have to, and I am hopeful. But as the recent IPCC Environmental Report indicates, we've run out of time. We are going to have a changing climate. And I think that's another reason why bringing environmental stewardship and conservation into everyday homes through consumerism is an important part of what we need to do. Yes, we need our governments to act boldly. Yes, we need to have corporations and businesses change their approach and their corporate behaviors. But we also need to do that as individuals. And I think that's where programs like the Conservation Ranching Program have a vital role to play.

This interview has been edited for brevity and clarity.

You can watch Marshall’s TED Talk online. For the 2021 IPCC Environmental Report click here.

Spotlight on Jimmy Flatt

BY CARA SCHAEFER

Hunting has been around for almost as long as humankind, but it’s a practice that many of us aren’t familiar with today. We spoke with Jimmy Flatt, one of the founders of Hunters of Color, about his passion for hunting, the value of mentorship, and bringing more people into the sport. 

Photos courtesy of Jimmy Flatt.

OUT THERE: Can you describe your first experience with hunting?

JIMMY FLATT: My dad is ex-military. And so, from an early age, I knew how to shoot. I was always intrigued by hunting, and one of my best friends at the time, his dad knew that I had an interest in getting out, so he invited me and my dad out on my first hunt when I was eight years old. Although I wasn't toting a gun around, or even had my hunting license at the time, I went along for the ride. 

I was out in the Central Valley of California, a place called Grizzly Island, where it was super foggy that morning. It was probably somewhere close to freezing. I had a leaky pair of waders, so I was sitting in the water shivering. And I was kind of miserable, until the first set of ducks came in. Watching the dogs work, and being able to see how pretty the birds were up close...that's what hooked me.

OT: What are some of the joys and challenges of hunting?

JF: You go through a roller coaster of emotions while you hunt, because you are really immersing yourself into the circle of life. You get to see animals closer than most do. You see their behaviors. You see how beautiful they are. And at the same time, you're also taking life and making sure that you are putting food on the table for your life to be sustained. It's so fulfilling knowing that if you do eat meat, you're actively immersing yourself into the ecology, and just really having a hands-on approach to putting meat on the table.

OT: Have you ever observed any cool wildlife you weren't expecting on a hunt?

JF: Oh, yeah, all the time. I've seen one mountain lion. I'm sure there's been a lot more who've seen me. The coolest experience that I've had is with a hawk, which is the namesake of Hunters of Color. I was in California, and the night before I'd been walking around, and I saw a bunch of deer, but I just couldn't get close enough. 

The next day I went out to the same spot looking for the deer, and this hawk came and landed maybe ten feet above me, and was checking me out. He got even closer and landed right in front of me — it's super rare to see hawks on the ground. As I was sitting there watching the hawk, a deer came into the pasture in front of me. As the hawk flew away, I stood up and was able to take a shot. After I got the deer, the hawk came back and was just watching me process the deer. It was one of the weirdest experiences that I've ever had.

Photos courtesy of Jimmy Flatt.

OT: What made you decide to start Hunters of Color?

JF: Growing up in the Bay Area in California, it’s one of the most diverse regions in the United States. But the second I got out into the hunting woods, that diversity just disappeared.  I observed it when I was growing up, but there was no factual evidence to back it until 2016 when a US Fish and Wildlife survey came out that did a demographic study of license holders in the United States. And it showed 97% of all license owners in the United States were white. To me, that was kind of like the “Aha” moment. I kept thinking, “Okay. How am I going to do outreach into communities that would normally not have any access to hunting?” 

At first I thought communities that are in cities or detached from rural areas were going to be the most susceptible to being detached from hunting traditions, but then it quickly dawned on me that it was way more nuanced than that. It was not just people that were living in cities, it was people who are a couple generations or just one generation detached from their hunting lineage. That’s how Hunters of Color began to form. 

OT: Would you be willing to talk a bit about the three pillars of Hunters of Color and the importance of each?

JF: Yeah, there's education, mentorship, and conservation. Education is twofold. We are educating the general public that it is okay to hunt. That it's innately human to eat meat, and to hunt. Anybody who's alive today, our ancestors hunted. We all share that commonality. And so just to make sure that everybody knows that hunting isn't some bloodlust thing — that we're not all out there trying to kill as many animals as possible. We actually do the opposite. Hunters put more money into conservation efforts than any other group of people that recreate. The second is educating the BIPOC community that hunting is something that we do. We have educational programs where we're working on curriculums for elementary school kids and summer camp stuff, where it does a breakdown of hunting history and the steps that you would take to get into hunting. Even if we don't create hunters, we're going to create people who have an understanding of what hunting is, and who will advocate for hunting in the future.

Then there's mentorship. I like to say that if you remove anybody from anything for one generation, it's really hard for anybody to get back into that thing. So with hunting — if you weren't taught by your father, your grandfather, your mother, your grandmother — it's really hard to get started, especially if you don't have anybody in your immediate circle to teach you. And so that's where the mentorship program comes in. We have people who have learned to hunt who are willing to teach somebody, a new person, how to hunt. The reason I think the mentorship program is so valuable, and so needed, is because it’s rewarding for the mentee, but also extremely fulfilling for the mentor to see somebody come into hunting and fall in love with it.

And there's conservation. At the root of all hunting is conservation. We want to protect the wild resources that we are utilizing. Part of that is putting money into it, and actively pursuing areas where we can improve upon the habitat. We need to make sure that the animals continue to be there, so that we always maintain the resource that we’re using. 

OT: How has mentorship continued to play a role in your own experiences with hunting and outdoor sports?

JF: I'm smiling thinking about it right now. Every time I bring a new hunter out, and I see the joy that's in their face from getting their first harvest, or just being outdoors for the first time and seeing animals, it just brings me back to when I was a little kid learning how to hunt for the first time with my dad and friends, side by side. Those are some of the best memories I have in my life. I feel like I'm passing that forward and giving the platform for people to create those memories for themselves.

OT: What advice do you have for new hunters? 

JF: Get out of your comfort zone a little bit and learn all you can learn. Don't expect it to come quickly. Hunting takes years to master. I didn't get my first turkey for five years. Then once I switched over to archery later on in life, I didn't get one for another three years. The learning process happens throughout hunting. There's always new obstacles, but it's all part of the process. You’ll remember every single time you go out and hunt, but you won't remember every time you sit home and don't go hunting.

This interview has been edited for brevity and clarity.

You can find Hunters of Color at their website or on Instagram. To see the 2016 US Fish and Wildlife Survey click here.

Spotlight on Anna Le

BY CARA SCHAEFER

Teachers can help guide us along new paths — or “trails” — in life. We spoke with environmental educator and ecologist Anna Le about bringing new perspectives to environmental education, making kids comfortable in the classroom, and some of the best furry denizens of Yellowstone National Park. 

Photos courtesy of Anna Le.

OUT THERE: What led you to the environmental field?

ANNA LE: I grew up fishing with my parents. I'm originally from Southern California, so the beach was about an hour away from us. With my culture embedded into the fishing, and the great memories with my parents and my siblings just being outside next to the ocean, that led me down the path of getting into marine biology. And it wasn't until two years into marine biology in college, that I realized that I got really horrible seasickness, and then switched over to freshwater ecosystems!

OT: You taught some online educational courses for kids during the pandemic. Do you have a memory from that which makes you smile? 

AL: Everyone that I talked to — all the adults — were saying, “Kids are not going to be affected by the pandemic. It doesn't really matter to them because they're still young.” But having that connection online was so important, because it actually provided a completely different resource for all these introverted students (who tend to not participate in classroom settings) and for students who don't really benefit from how the education system is set up. With them having their own screen, I told them, “Whatever you need to feel comfortable, whether it's turning off your microphone or turning off your camera, just participate in any way you can.”

I found that increasingly a lot more students actually participated and answered questions and played these games alongside me. And, a lot of the time, students became more vulnerable, just because of them not being able to grieve as adults would, and also being able to be more open because they’re in this online world instead of in-person. That kind of opportunity to be more vulnerable and open with one another, and actually share, was really awesome to see during the pandemic. 

OT: Are there any changes you would like to see when it comes to the field of environmental science and/or conservation?

AL: One of the primary changes I would like to see is diversity in perspectives. Right now, you're only seeing all these old white men in this field, with years of knowledge, which I super respect, but I would love to see a change bringing new perspectives and new audiences as well. I think representation is so important. For example, I am the only BIPOC educator in my entire organization here in Yellowstone National Park, so when I'm relaying information to and educating kids, it's really important for me to have this representation as a woman of color to say, “Hey, you can also be here and feel comfortable doing so.”

I would also love the incorporation of new and better materials. I remember the first week on my job training here, I had another educator quote five John Muir quotes in a single setting, and that was just completely shocking. Whereas there's a lot of other naturalists, environmental educators, and environmentalists —  and indigenous and Native communities that have been doing this for thousands of years — that we don't necessarily quote. 

It’s important to actually have different languages incorporated into these curricula as well. For the past few weeks in particular, that whole safety aspect of “don't approach bison, don't touch the hot springs” didn't really come across, because there's a huge language barrier. And then for me, it's like, “Why are these signs not in multiple languages? Why am I the only person of color, who can only speak one language, and not be able to talk to people who primarily spoke Spanish or primarily spoke Cantonese?” And for me that barrier translates over to a lot of people saying, “Oh, they're just not knowledgeable or don't care about the environment.” But in reality, we are not meeting them where they’re at. 

OT: Currently you're working as a field educator and leading wildlife tours in Yellowstone. What's been one of your favorite wildlife experiences?

AL: Anything dealing with wolves or bears, because they are the top predators in the ecosystem, and because of their history as well  — predators used to not be here, because a lot of people wanted to wipe them out. Bison have a long history here as well. There used to be 50 to 60 million bison, and now the largest herd found is here in Yellowstone National Park with about 5,000 individuals. We've made a lot of mistakes, but we’ve come a long way. And now we’re able to see the ecosystem playing out as it should be, with the natural food chain and interactions between predator and prey. 

OT: How do those animals interact with each other?

AL: For the most part, they give each other space. You’ve got to be mindful that one individual, full-grown bison can get up to 1,800 to 2,000 pounds. So it's not going to be every single day that a pack of wolves is taking down a bison. For the most part, bison are on their own, bears are doing their own thing, and the wolves are milling about and being the kings of the valley. It's just pretty incredible to see that all of these animals can coexist with one another and not have that much conflict, though when it comes to it they do need to feed themselves and eat somehow. 

OT: You've also seen a lot of badgers, which are ADORABLE. Can you tell me more about your encounters with them?

AL: My first trip to Yellowstone was in 2017, and every single hike I did, I saw these really massive, deep holes in the sagebrush habitat. Since then, I’ve sprained multiple ankles falling into these holes. So being out there and finally getting to see the source...because they’re very elusive. In one acre, you'll have like 20 different badger holes, but you never get to see the animal itself. 

This year, I saw 50 or so cars pulled off the side of the road. And I'm like, “Okay, this might be a wolf or a bear or something.” So as we got out they’re like, “No, it’s a badger.” And, I kid you not, I freaked out so hard, because this was my first time seeing a badger. I didn't realize how cute they were! Just completely adorable, like the size of an ottoman. Huffing and bustling in the sagebrush with their really long, aggressive-looking claws. I found myself, even on the weekends, waking up super early to go seek them out. 

OT: What advice would you give someone looking to view wildlife outdoors? 

AL: Don't be afraid to ask questions! If you can afford it, book some tours, though I know a lot of families and individuals cannot. But try your best to ask a lot of questions about where the wildlife could be, and when you're out there, don't be shy to actually ask community members if you can take a look into their scope or for advice on spotting wildlife. In my opinion, it's better to share the space and the knowledge so everyone can see wildlife. Nothing's worse than traveling across the country on a three day road trip, or flying out here and waking up at  5 a.m. to go watch wildlife, and realizing that you don't have the gear or the dollars to see wildlife. 

And it goes back to the other side too. Whenever you can, try not to gatekeep. Share that knowledge and share the experience with one another. 

This interview has been edited for brevity and clarity.

You can find Anna on Instagram.

Spotlight on Brandon Reynolds

BY CARA SCHAEFER

Hear a buzzing noise in your ear? It just might be a bustling, vivacious bee, but rest assured there’s no need to fear. We spoke with Brandon Reynolds, founder and “Chief Bee” of B The Keeper, about beekeeping, taking inspiration from nature, and how to help your local pollinators.

Photos courtesy of Brandon Reynolds.

OUT THERE: Why do you feel so drawn to bees?

BRANDON REYNOLDS: That’s the question that I love the most. It’s not like, why are you drawn to be in advertising? It’s, “Why are you so drawn to be connected with this creature that so many people are afraid of, except for the fact that they love eating honey?” 

Bees, to survive, have to be so dialed into the ebb and flow of the environment. I feel like so many of us, me for a lot of my life included, have been so distanced from the environment. Whereas when you look at bees, their success wholly depends on: Is there enough food available for them to bring back to the hive? Is there adequate rain? Is it too cold? Are there pesticides and herbicides in the immediate area that are going to cause a lot of poison? What about the different insects or the mites? There's so many pieces of their development that it requires them to use all of their senses to survive their day to day. I'm so drawn to bees because it encourages me to use all of myself, to really tap into and observe the environment.

OT: What does beekeeping itself actually entail?

BR: A lot of people think beekeeping is the act of going into hives, putting on a suit, smoking the bees so they're a little more calm and collected. And sure — that's beekeeping as an activity. But what I’ve found over the years is that it’s what our name implies. It’s being a keeper. Being a steward for the colonies — the colonies that you serve, but also the wild colonies that you haven't ever seen. And even more so the different native bees that you will probably never find, unless you really went on a search mission. For me, beekeeping is all about how much pollinator habitat you are creating in your environment to support the local wildlife.

OT: What's your “parenting strategy” when it comes to taking care of bees?

BR: My parenting strategy is not being a helicopter parent. First and foremost, it's showing up to a colony when I'm needed, as opposed to when I need to. Letting them show me what they're working on, what they need, and me — instead of doing the work for them — taking a step back, understanding what they're communicating, and then helping where it's necessary. You create a system where the bees have more control, more ownership of their environment, and you're rewarded with bees that don't perish over the winter, bees that don't run out of food, and bees that are able to naturally keep off disease without any of your help, and I love it.

OT: What are some of the most common myths or things you hear that are just straight up wrong about bees?

BR: Bees aren't actually as aggressive as people say they are. Sure, bees sting people. It's a defense mechanism. It happens. Most of the time though — and I've been in hives with friends and students and apprentices — you got your arms exposed, you got your legs exposed, you're digging in this box with thousands of bees, and you haven't been stung. 

I think attacking that misconception is really key. A lot of the reasons why people aren't thinking about nature as mindfully as they could, is because of fear. And I think dismantling that fear — even through something as simple as saying, “Hey, bees actually don't sting people when they're not provoked. And even if they are provoked, they're kind of like, ‘This is a last resort because I'm going to die after I do this, and I really would rather stay alive to eat some of that sweet stuff — I think dismantling the fear of bees actually could help people get more in tune with their environment. It's important to show that not only can you keep bees without cause for a significant injury, you can lower your guard in nature.

OT: How do we protect pollinators like bees in urban environments?

BR: Thinking outside of the hive. The biggest thing is give them some habitat. Give them an environment to actually just be bees. Plan out your landscape to be packed with native perennial plants, and you're a better beekeeper than most people, because you're creating habitat that stabilizes pollinator populations. So plant some stuff for bees!

OT: Are there any plants or other features that are especially great for creating pollinator habitat?

BR: If you want to add more native pollinators to your landscape, I would recommend looking for organizations in your part of town, look for your experts, look for your elders, look for the people that actually know the plant palette of your community, and really dig into what plants are native here. And how can I put them on my property in a way that is not only functional for the environment, but is also really aesthetically pleasing to the eye for my fellow humans. As soon as you can bridge that gap, you'll be planting more pollinator habitat than you thought you ever could. 

There are also a lot of pollinators that make nests in old logs and trees. If you want to add some texture to your yard and provide a safe space for bees, leave that log cut down and let nature do its thing. Bees will appreciate you for it.

OT: What has beekeeping taught you personally? 

BR: Beekeeping has really encouraged me to go through life with my eyes wide open. When you think about scout bees, they're looking for food or a potential home, they have to use all of themselves to acquire information and make change. The information that they bring back is something that could make or break a colony. And when I think about this looming, ever-present, ever-growing issue of climate change, and how it's my charge as a beekeeper, as a keeper of the environment, to help reverse climate change, I really take inspiration from the bees and how they motivate me to go through life constantly looking for opportunities. Realizing that you may just be one person, you may just be one bee in a hive, but you giving your all to help remedy an error, could have society-altering ripples that benefit everyone. So bees really, I love them. I love that they encourage me to be alive, stay open, and realize that everything is possible, if you want it to be.

This interview has been edited for brevity and clarity.

You can find Brandon on Instagram.

Spotlight on Temple Grandin

BY CARA SCHAEFER

How does the way we think shape our interactions with nature? We spoke with Temple Grandin, professor of animal science at Colorado State and autism rights advocate, about cattle, animal behavior, and outdoor experiences. 

Photos courtesy of Temple Grandin.

OUT THERE: Do you have any childhood memories of interacting with animals or the outdoors?

TEMPLE GRANDIN: Oh yes, I'm a child of the 50s. And mom would say, “Go outside and run the energy out of you.” The neighborhood kids and I just spent huge amounts of time outside. We’d make up our own games, we’d go for hikes in the woods, and build forts. I spent hours flying kites when I was a child,  that was one of my favorite activities — experimenting and building kites. 

My sister and I would collect rocks. I collected insects. The things that I liked best when I was a little kid were things that flew. If something flew, I liked it, whether it was kites or toy airplanes. 

OT: How did you come to work with cattle in particular? 

TG: I'm an Easterner and I was not exposed to agriculture until I was a teenager. I was also a kid that had a lot of problems. I did not work out well in a regular high school. Kids bullied me. And I threw a book at a girl who called me a retard, so I got kicked out of ninth grade. I went to a boarding school for kids that had problems, and they had a farm there: a 12-cow dairy. So that was my first introduction to cattle, and then a little later on in my teenage life I went out to my aunt's ranch out west. And that's where I got introduced to the beef industry, and also introduced to the west and found that I really liked it.

OT: What are some of the differences between how animals and humans communicate that you've noticed? 

TG: Well, an animal lives in a sensory-based world. I'm an extreme visual thinker. So when I first started working with cattle in my 20s, I looked at what the cattle were looking at. And they might see a shadow going through a chute or a coat on a fence, and it would make them stop. And other people hadn't thought to look at what the cattle were looking at. I didn't know at the time that a lot of other people think mainly in words. It wasn’t until I was in my 30s or so when I first got an inkling that other people didn’t think in pictures quite the same way I did. But it was obvious to me, as a visual thinker, to look at what the cattle were looking at. Being very sensory-based in how I think, helped me understand animals. 

OT: Why do you think it's important to treat cattle and other animals in a humane way? 

TG: Animals have feelings. They feel pain, they feel fear. When I first started out, it was considered anthropomorphic to think that animals have emotions. Now scientists know that that's simply not true. Back in the early 90s, journal article reviewers wouldn't let me use the word “fear.” I had to say that the animal was agitated. 

But the interesting thing is, over in the neuroscience literature, the word “fear” had been used for years. And now in some of the animal behavior literature, you'll actually see the word “personality” being used. And terms like “bold” versus “shy.” And obviously animals like dogs have emotions, because drugs that work on people for things like anxiety also work for dogs. For example, Prozac works on dogs. And that would show that there's some similarity between our nervous system and a dog's nervous system. 

OT: One project I heard you recently consulted on is an autism nature trail at Letchworth State Park in New York. As someone who is autistic, how do you personally experience nature?

TG: I really like to look at things. During the Covid lockdown, I’ve been observing some of the crows in the neighborhood. And sitting outside in the gazebo I watch the squirrel repeatedly try to bury a nut. Even in a suburban environment, there are things to observe.

The Canada geese have been very interesting here. I've lived in Colorado for 31 years. When I first moved here, they were in vast flocks and you’d see them out on a crop field. Now they've broken up into social groups of maybe 12 to 15. And you'll even see single pairs, like hanging out on the bank lawn or the road divider. So the behavior has changed — they don't migrate. There’s no predators. They know that once they're west of the freeway, they don't have to worry about hunters. 

OT: Are there any sensory details you're especially attuned to when you're outdoors?

TG: Well, I'm a very visual person. I had a student one time and she was very auditory. And she would listen to an animal, listen to how it breathed. And then she could tell whether or not it was stressed. I tend to look. Like one of the crows sampled some water in a pothole in the middle of the road. He didn’t like that water, but he liked the water a lot better that was in a puddle in the grass.

OT: How do you think we can make the outdoors a more welcoming environment to those who are autistic or otherwise neurodivergent?

TG: The first thing is you've got to get them doing things. One of the big problems is that kids aren’t being exposed to enough stuff. You know, a lot of these kids would be recluses in their room unless they're encouraged to do things. And it's important to give choices. So would you like to go for a walk in the park, or to go do something else? Always do choices, but you've got to get them outside and show them interesting stuff. 

This interview has been edited for brevity and clarity.

You can find Temple at her website or read more about her work with animals here.

Spotlight on Amanda Reynolds

BY CARA SCHAEFER

“Follow your dreams” is an oft-repeated phrase, but what does it take to actually do so? We talk with Amanda Reynolds about meteorology, weather broadcasting, and perseverance.

Photos courtesy of Amanda Reynolds.

OUT THERE: What sparked your interest in meteorology?

AMANDA REYNOLDS: I was always really interested in weather as a kid. In elementary school, we had to do a nature journal. Basically, we had to pick some sort of aspect of nature that we wanted to do a project on every quarter. I did tornadoes..and hurricanes, and earthquakes. And I got to the point that my teacher was like, “Okay, for the fourth quarter, you have to do something that's not weather.”

Then that summer, the summer of 2005, one of my best friends and I decided we were going to do a hurricane journal. We were going to track all of the hurricanes that summer. Well, it turned out that summer was the most active hurricane season on record, where they had gone to the Greek alphabet for the very first time. And so we had a whole lot of hurricanes to track and that was really the catalyst. It was like, “Oh, this is really fun! I really enjoy this.” And from then on, I just wanted to study weather all the time. 

OT: Do you have a go-to cool weather fact?

There's no such thing as heat lightning. Lightning that you can see, but don't hear any thunder, is just too far away for you to hear the thunder.

OT: One thing you're passionate about is supporting women in STEM careers. What has made you feel supported as a woman in the STEM field? 

AR: When I was in high school I knew that I wanted to do weather and broadcasting, and I had a lot of pushback from people. We had a vocational school that was tied to our high school and they had a broadcast and media program. I wanted to do that and everyone's like, “You're smart. Like, you're gifted. Why would you want to go to the tech school? You're better than that.”

They didn’t understand what it was really about, so being able to push through that, and the support I got once I was in that program, was really important. And then when I was able to go to college, there were all sorts of female role models that I would see at Penn State. To see people living the life that I wanted to live eventually was really inspiring. Now I strive to be someone that can be inspiring for others. 

OT: What are some challenges you faced pursuing a STEM career in meteorology?

AR: Sexism was always something that's been there. I had issues with that at one of my positions, But I think, growing up...I'm a very tiny person. I'm only about five feet tall. And so I was always treated like I was so much younger and almost inferior to everybody else. People would tell me “you don't know what you want”. Like, you're so young, even though I was a late teenager. And I’ve known what I wanted to do my entire life, and so kind of being able to prove to people that I know what I want to do, I am good at what I do, and you should believe in me as much as I believe in myself. Most of the time, people understand and people listen. Sometimes, unfortunately, there are people that don't. And sometimes you just have to get over that and move on, because they're not going to change their mind no matter what you do or say.

OT: Are there any weather broadcasting myths you would like to clear up? 

AR: One myth is that the meteorologists you see on TV are just a pretty face, especially females. We put a lot of work into what we do. A majority of the people that you see working on TV doing weather have gone to school for years to study weather, to learn how to forecast and learn how the weather works. Just because they're on TV, doesn't mean that they're not good at science. 

Also, one thing that comes up with weather a lot is, “How can you do your job and get paid if you're wrong 50% of the time?” Well, what we often liken it to is a March Madness bracket. You're predicting a bracket all the way out, and if one thing goes wrong early in your bracket, your bracket becomes a mess very quickly. There's lots of different aspects to forecasting weather, and so you have to be very careful about what you do and say, at what exact point. 

And just because we say there's a 50% chance it’s going to rain, doesn't mean there's a 100% chance that it's going to rain where you are. It may be raining five miles away. Just because it's wrong for you one day, doesn't mean that we don't know what we're doing. We're good at what we do, but we can’t predict the future. 

OT: What advice would you give someone who's looking to pursue a childhood dream?

AR: Don't listen to what people say. If you know what you want to do, follow that to the best of your ability. If your dreams change, that's fine. But if they don't, you'll have a leg up when you do get to a point that you can follow it. 

This interview has been edited for brevity and clarity.

You can find Amanda on Twitter.

Spotlight on Dustin Young

BY CARA SCHAEFER

Our relationship with the natural world is often complex, but nature itself can be surprisingly minimalist. We spoke with Dustin D. Young, a Louisiana-based artist, who captures this stark beauty through contour line drawings and other works of art.

Photos courtesy of Dustin Young.

OUT THERE: What was the start of your artistic journey? And how has that evolved over time?

DUSTIN YOUNG: It’s hard to pinpoint. I was always doodling because I'm an introvert by nature. When I need to keep myself occupied, I draw, and it has slowly and organically transformed to what it is now. It’s like that book by Austin Keleon, “Steal Like an Artist” — he doesn't really mean to steal, but to get some ideas. Try to make things your own. That’s what I try to do.

OT: Nature is a common theme in your art. Why do you think you are drawn to flowers, insects and other aspects of the natural world?

DY: I think as a society, we're getting away from nature. For example, I have a daughter who doesn't even play outside. We’re losing touch. In my house, I have all kinds of plants. They all come from being raised by my grandmother; she loves plants. I just like the feel. I sometimes talk to them as well. 

OT: On your website, it says you try to create a sense of “visual calm” in your work. What do you personally associate with a sense of calm or tranquility?

DY: I'm trying with the whole minimalist aspect of flowers to convey that nature's much simpler — and not to overthink. When I draw these flowers, there's no rhyme or no rules. It’s wherever I put the pen down, try to imitate nature, that’s what I get. 

OT: Is there a plant or animal that shows up more than others in your work or even everyday life?

DY: Tulips when I first started to attempt a contour line drawing. I have a tub full of tulips people have never seen. I practiced over and over, trying to convey that tulip the best I could. That's my flower.

OT: How do you respond when a drawing doesn't turn out the way you hoped it would?

DY: I tear it up! I tear it up and start over from the same perspective point that I started out with. Also, I keep in mind we as human beings are too critical of ourselves sometimes. I think once I let go of that more, the drawings took on more of a life of their own. People started gravitating to them, once I let go of the fear of what others thought. 

OT: When you sit down to a blank piece of paper, how do you decide what to draw? 

DY: I find a song and I put it on repeat. It depends on the mood I’m in. Let’s say I was drawing a tulip. I would want to work from the bottom, from the leaves to the actual tulip. I don’t want to jumble up the image with too many back-and- forth, crossing lines. Then something within me says, “Hey, it’s done.” Leonardo da Vinci said it best: “Art is never finished, only abandoned.” 

OT: In what ways do you hope to use art to continue to explore the world around you?

DY: I would like to keep it in the realm of nature, because it's something that’s not man-made. Something that man really doesn't have control over, even though he tries to alter it. He doesn’t have that say so against a cell, a nucleus, or a life. That's what makes it magical for me.

This interview has been edited for brevity and clarity.

You can find Dustin at his website or on Instagram.

Spotlight on Jess Shen

BY CARA SCHAEFER

If something is holding you back from planning your next adventure, Jess Shen just might be the inspiration you need. We spoke with her about solo travel, getting into hiking, and making your body home. 

Photos courtesy of Jess Shen.

OUT THERE: So you just got back from an amazing road trip. What was one of the most memorable experiences you had along the way?

JESS SHEN: I hiked my first 13,000 foot peak in Great Basin Park, and the view from the top was just stunning! It was a lot of time to just enjoy nature and spend quality time with myself.

OT: Was there anything that didn't go as expected?

JS: There was a tornado warning in South Dakota, so I took shelter at Wind Cave National Park Visitor Center. I had expected tornadoes, but I didn't expect to get that in South Dakota versus like Tornado Alley. I was in Oklahoma, Kansas, Nebraska — it was fine. I get into South Dakota and the clouds and the weather just changed immediately. It was actually pretty terrifying, but I’m safe and that's all that matters. 

OT: When it comes to solo travel, what do you most appreciate? And what do you find to be a challenge?

JS: I do love that it's a very selfish thing. I don't have to plan around other people or worry about them canceling on me. It's something that is very liberating, because I get to plan the trip for me, and not have to cater to other people's needs and desires. 

The challenging part is that, if something happens, the only person I can rely on is myself. I have to do all the driving for the road trip. I have to make sure that I’ve packed everything, that I’m safe, and that I look after myself. It’s the double-edged sword kind of thing: I get the most freedom, but then I also have the most responsibility.

OT: So going back a bit, how did you start hiking? 

JS: I did do many hikes over the years, just very sporadically, like I hiked Mount Sinai in Egypt in 2017. But it's one of those things where I was so uncomfortable with my body that I didn't think I could hike. Even though everybody in any shape or form can hike. What I just always thought was, “Oh, I'm a bigger bodied person. I go too slow. I don't belong on the trail. The outdoors isn’t for me. I hate hiking”. 

Last year, due to the pandemic, I had a lot of time to reflect on myself and my relationship with my body. It became — not that I want to push body positivity, because I think it's very difficult to be in love with your body every single day — more of an acceptance thing. I accept my bigger body, and I know that it's strong. It does what I want it to do. After that, I started to do little short trails. Then I would do longer ones, and it just incrementally increased since the start of the lockdown. It was something that gave me time to not be stressed out due to the pandemic. 

OT: I saw you posted at one point that your body is your “home”, which I thought was a really beautiful sentiment. So how does hiking make you feel more at home in your body? And does that feeling transfer to other areas of your life as well? 

JS: Hiking gives me a sense that regardless of how my body appears, that it can take me to see some incredible views and that it's a step forward. Even if I don't finish the trail, like if I turn around due to unsafe conditions, every single time is a step towards spending more quality time with just me and my body, and nature. It’s all interconnected. 

It does translate to other things because I don't spend as much time beating myself up over what my body looks like. It’s more like, “Wow, my legs took me up that mountain” or, “Wow, my calves led me to this hike”. It’s a very personal experience that leads me to appreciate how my body is.

OT: What tips do you have for someone who is looking to start hiking or just get outside more?

JS: Preparation is always key. You want to bring more than you think you’ll need. You want to bring water and sunscreen. I always try to bring a hat just for some shade. I will look up the trail in advance, have a map.

It doesn't have to be something hard. It can even just be a walk around your neighborhood or a walk on urban trails. There are urban trails near where I live that I really enjoy. It's just about being outside. 

Let people know where you will be. I solo hike, but my parents know the trails I plan to take. They know the trailhead. They know what time I'm roughly going to start, and what time to be worried if they don't hear from me.

This interview has been edited for brevity and clarity.

You can find Jess on Instagram.

Out There Podcast wins national award

Out There has won a national award from the Public Media Journalists Association, or PMJA.

PMJA is a nationwide association of public radio journalists. Their annual awards honor the best audio stories of the year, and our episode “A Series of Unlikely Events” took second place in the independent podcast division.

The episode was written and produced by former Out There intern Aja Simpson. We are so proud of her!

This is Out There's fifth national award.

Over the past six years, three of our episodes — “Selfless Acts”, “The Instinct to Kill” and "High on Failure" — have received gold medals, and one episode — “Failure in Success” — took second place.

It's an honor to be recognized by the most respected voices in public radio. And as always, it's a delight to be making the show for all of you, our listeners.

Out There host Willow Belden with the podcast’s PMJA award (Photo by Willow Belden)

Spotlight on Casey Clapp

BY CARA SCHAEFER

Have you looked up at some leaves lately? We spoke with Casey Clapp, arborist and co-host of the podcast Completely Arbortrary, about all things tree-related, from common misconceptions to why you might want to go plant a tree yourself. 

Photos courtesy of Casey Clapp.

OUT THERE: So this is gonna be a hard one. What do you love most about trees?

CASEY CLAPP: I think one thing that I like about trees is their dignity. Trees, as they grow, just keep on going. It doesn't matter where they are, because they get one shot at growing and living for as long as they can. They can't decide, “Oh, I think I'm just gonna move over here. I don't like Seattle anymore. I'm going to Denver.” They have to say, “This is where I'm growing, this is my spot.” It's literally do or die. They’re always constantly doing their absolute best with what they have. And most of the time, they're just ridiculously beautiful about it. No matter how we cut them down, they just keep coming back. 

OT: As a municipal arborist, what does your average day at work look like?

CC: My normal day would be looking at different trees and different plans for trees. The city code requires that as part of a development or remodeling project you have to maintain, plant, or remove and replant the existing street trees. So my job is to go through all these plans and say, “Okay, you can retain this tree, that's a good tree, here's how to retain it. No, you can't retain that tree, here's what you need to do to get rid of it and replant a new one.” Or look at plans and say, “Okay, there's no trees here at all. So we're going to figure out how to move around all the other different infrastructure pieces in the right way, whether that's driveways, power lines, poles, streetlights, fire hydrants, utility crossings, anything like that.” I do the review to make sure that all of those trees are getting put in properly with good spacing, to make sure that we have street trees as pieces of infrastructure included in all of these new developments. 

OT: So what are some of the benefits of planting trees in urban areas? 

CC: Oh, what a good question! The benefits of trees are many and varied. Here in the Northern Hemisphere, the sun hits all of our buildings on the south side. So the north side is always shaded, but the south side is really hot. So if you plant a tree there, and that tree grows up over the top of your house, now you're benefiting from that tree. Simply by shading your house, you don't have to spend as much money on air conditioning, you have a more comfortable microclimate, and you can open your window and cool the inside of your house. They also do the same thing with pollution. They help to get rid of ozone and CO2, obviously, because they store carbon. 

Trees also help to do some not-so-measurable things as well. Trees have a calming effect. So if you are having a stressful day, just going outside and hearing trees or the wind rustling through trees or seeing the green color provides a calming effect for people, whether or not you know it is happening. Then if you are reducing stress it makes people happier, and when you're making people happier, they're more productive. There's been studies that have seen this and said, “Well, if you have a landscape, even just some kind of grass, you tend to find more satisfaction at your job, and then you're more productive”. There are psychological benefits that you get from trees that you don't have to go out to the forest to get if you have them planted right here in streets, like where I'm walking right now!

OT: Has climate change and its effect on trees changed how you approach your job or trees in general?

CC: For sure. Specifically in the urban area, most trees that are municipally owned are planted in what people call the planter strip, which is that kind of grassy lawn-like area between the curb and the sidewalk. That area specifically, it's kind of left out when everyone's looking at this road. So the soil there is usually just awful. You have to have tough trees. 

If you are planting trees that normally, say 30 years ago, would be doing just fine, now those same exact trees would be struggling a lot, because we have higher temperatures during the summer and we have less water falling at other times. They're already in a tough spot to grow and live, and when you add climate change, everything kind of gets exacerbated. So now it's completely untenable. 

Also we're planting different trees now. It's kind of a weird transition, where we're seeing certain trees that used to do really well, doing awful, but we're trying to see if we can plant new trees that will change the entire ecosystem up here in terms of what species are more adapted to Northern Oregon.

OT: Do you have a memory of trees that brings warm fuzzies to your heart?

CC: I built a treehouse with my friend Joey, years and years ago. We just had so much fun because we found all this wood and created this massive, complex structure between these two douglas firs. We had electricity out there; we would go to different garage sales around the area and pick out different stuff to add to it. To this day we still talk about it.

OT: What's the most bizarre or coolest tree you've ever heard of?

CC: The banyan tree is probably one of my top favorites in terms of a crazy tree, because the banyan tree grows as a strangler fig. It'll land on top of a branch, send out its roots, grow all the way down to the ground, and then kick over the tree that it just grew on and become a new tree. It just seems so hardcore. 

OT: What's the one thing you wish everyone knew about trees, or a tree misconception you would like to clear up?

CC: I think there’s two main ones. The first would be that tree roots do not mirror their upper canopies. You've seen this on a hundred shirts, but in fact they don't. They grow very flat, even those of tall trees like the douglas fir or ponderosa pine. They're more similar to a wine glass, where their roots only grow in the top maybe two to three feet of soil most of the time, but they grow really far out. And so whenever someone says, “Well, we're not even near that tree,” the roots of that tree are probably underneath our feet right now, even though you're 30 feet away. 

The second one would be that “trees are dangerous”. That is the thing that bothers me the most, where people are worried about maintenance issues or a tree getting too big. I always don't like that term “too big” of a tree. It’s like saying that the ocean gets too wet. Trees are big. That's their definition. And people a lot of the time see them and think, “Well, that tree is big; therefore it's dangerous”. When in reality the larger and bigger and older the tree, the longer it's been able to adapt to its surroundings. It's been able to put on new wood and add different amounts of structure to it to make sure that it can stand up. So people don't appreciate two main things in regards to that. One, it’s in the tree’s best interest to stand up just the same as it's in your interest that that tree stands up. So don't sell the tree short; that tree’s like, “I hope I don’t fall over. That'd be the single worst thing for me, much less you. You'll rebuild your house. I'll be dead”. 

Meanwhile, they also don't appreciate the fact that trees are made of wood. We build our houses of wood, we build decks of wood, we build entire structures made of wood. And we think, well, that's a good structure because we humans engineered it. We didn't. We just took the pieces apart and put them back together in a different way. Trees themselves put each one of those individual cells together to make that wood as strong as it is. So the tree itself is very strong, it's actually doing a pretty good job. 

OT: Why should people immediately go listen to your podcast Completely Arbortrary?

CC: I think people should go listen to Completely Arbortrary because it is a show about trees and other related topics. So if you are thinking to yourself, “this has nothing to do with trees”, I am hoping to convince you otherwise. Or at the minimum, I'm hoping that Alex and I can convince you that trees are much more fascinating than anyone really gives them credit for!

This interview has been edited for brevity and clarity.

You can find Casey on Instagram and the podcast Completely Arbortrary at their website or on Instagram.

Black and Outdoorsy

A playlist celebrating Black experiences outdoors

We often hear that Black people are not outdoorsy — that African Americans don’t do nature. The reasons for this narrative are complex and have roots dating back to slavery. But in reality, a lot of Black Americans are outdoorsy, with deep connections to nature.

In honor of Juneteenth, a holiday commemorating the end of slavery in the United States, we’ve compiled a playlist of stories that highlight Black experiences outdoors and celebrate the diverse and meaningful ways that African Americans engage with the natural world.

Clockwise from top left: Angela Crenshaw, Ron Griswell, Kelsie Wilkins, Derick Lugo, Colin Howe

THE ULTIMATE OUTDOORSWOMAN

Harriet Tubman was more than a conductor on the Underground Railroad. She was a daughter, wife, entrepreneur — and a talented outdoorswoman.

On this episode, we explore Tubman’s relationship with nature; we unpack how that history shapes the way Black Americans engage with the outdoors today; and we show how a closer look at Tubman could offer new perspectives on who belongs outdoors.

MR. FABULOUS

On this episode, we share a conversation with Derick Lugo, a suave, manicured New Yorker who set out to thru-hike the Appalachian Trail. We discuss the warm welcome Derick received on the A.T. as a hiker of color; we talk about how the generosity he experienced on the trail shifted his habits back home; and we share the highly entertaining story behind his trail name. Plus: why you shouldn’t fear stepping outside your comfort zone.

BIRDING WHILE BLACK

Many of us like to think that nature is an equalizer — a place to escape the injustices of society. But it’s not so simple. On this episode, which first aired several years ago, we bring you the story of ornithologist and birder Drew Lanham and his quest to pursue his passion outdoors as a POC.

BEFORE IT’S TOO LATE

With both African American and Cherokee roots, Shannon Prince comes from a family with a rich relationship to the natural world. But her family’s eco-literacy had been stripped away over the generations, and by the time Shannon came along, there wasn’t much left to teach her.

Yearning to rediscover forgotten knowledge, Shannon traveled across the world, to a place where ancient traditions were more intact than her own. On this episode, she shares a story that takes us from Houston, Texas, to the remote meadows of Outer Mongolia and explores the surprising things that can happen to us on a personal level, when we attempt to preserve a way of life that’s slowly being stripped away.

A SERIES OF UNLIKELY EVENTS

In 2001, Donna Martino stuck a photograph on her fridge. It was a picture from the newspaper of a handsome kayaker paddling through the surf. A few months later, Donna matched with the man on a dating website. The rest is history.

We tend to assume that improbable beginnings are a recipe for disaster — that sappy romances can’t last — that fairytale endings are only for movies. But sometimes, the real world serves up a dose of schmaltz. This story is about what happens when coincidences pile up, and strangers go out on a limb and take a chance on each other.

8 MILES IN NYC

When Kelsie Wilkins moved to New York City, she quickly became overwhelmed. She had never felt so alone in a crowd. But eventually she did something that helped her belong. It began with a walk, and ended with a sense of camaraderie and connection. On this episode, Kelsie shares her story.

BLACK AND OUTDOORSY

If you attended a predominantly white college or university, there was probably an outdoors program on campus. And it was likely composed of mostly white people. If you went to a historically Black college or university, chances are, there was no outdoor program. And you probably grew up hearing that the outdoors was for white people.

On this episode, we talk with outdoor adventurer and educator Ron Griswell about his efforts to close the adventure gap. We share the story of how Ron became a leader in the outdoor industry; we discuss the barriers that keep many people of color from engaging in outdoor adventures; and we talk about the ways that Black joy can help combat racist narratives.

RESILIENCE THROUGH DIVERSITY

As a marine biologist, Colin Howe sees diversity as an indicator of health: the more diverse an ecosystem, the more likely it is to thrive. But while scientists work hard to preserve diversity in the wild, they often fail to achieve it in the workplace.

Colin is one of just a handful of Black biologists in the United States. On this episode, we talk with him about pursuing his passion in a predominantly white field. And we discuss what the oceans can teach us about the benefits of diversity.

Spotlight on Forrest Wood

BY CARA SCHAEFER

As the years pass, you may find yourself spending time outside in different ways, but there’s often a connective thread between the activities we love. We spoke with Forrest Wood, one of Out There’s production interns for the spring of 2021, about skateboarding, rock climbing, and storytelling. 

Photos courtesy of Forrest Wood.

OUT THERE: You spent a lot of time skateboarding as a kid. How did that come about?

FORREST WOOD: I went to a small public school in New York City that didn't have a school yard. For lunch, they would close off the block and just let us play in the street. There were some kids in middle school that rode skateboards, and one of them gave me their old skateboard one day and I kind of just never put it down.

OT: Was it difficult to learn?

FW: I think everyone who skates will be willing to share their gore stories. I've broken my elbow twice. I've hurt myself dozens of ways from skateboarding. People can go on and on, about how it’s a fine line between it being a healthy way to get exercise and a way to really hurt yourself. But for most people, the benefits outweigh the risks, like a lot of outdoor activities. There's an element of risk sometimes, but the people who invented skateboarding in the 60s are still skateboarding now in their old age. There's a love for it that you can't really get away from.

OT: Did skateboarding around the city feel like exploration to you? 

FW: Yeah, definitely. It was a way to get around. I was also getting into longboarding, which is bigger boards, softer wheels, and you can go a little bit faster. I commuted around the city on a longboard for a long time in high school. And then I went to college in Boston, and I almost exclusively commuted around Boston on a longboard or a bicycle, because I just really didn't like public transportation there.

It’s definitely a way to explore and see the neighborhoods that you're passing through in a different way. The communities are so welcoming, in those kinds of scenes, so it was a great way to meet people for me.

OT: What was the culture around skateboarding like, and how did you feel about it? 

FW: There's a lot of subcultures within skateboarding. Some people like skating in state parks. Then there's street skating, which is what a lot of people think of when they hear of skateboarding. There's also a lot of disciplines within longboarding, different  styles of doing tricks. There's a lot to learn within all of those disciplines, so the communities around them are a niche within a niche.

When you share a common interest like that with anyone, you can look past other differences. Age and socioeconomic background were really not even that much of a factor. When I first got introduced to the longboarding scene, I was a little high schooler from the Upper West Side. I was meeting people 10 years older than me, and we were just outside, pushing around to have fun. And no one really cared where anyone you met came from, or where anyone was going. It was all just about being with each other.

OT: Fast forward a bit to when you traded in your skateboard for a climbing rope, what was that transition like?

FW: I wouldn't say traded in, obviously, because I still try to skate. About a year after graduating college, I had moved back to New York and I was working in the theater industry. I was doing a lot of construction and labor, and I just wasn't happy. I really wanted to get out of the city and spend more time outside. I met a girl. She taught me how to rock climb, and I just really fell in love with it. 

I see a lot of similarities between skateboarding and rock climbing. It's about really pushing yourself and pushing your body to its limits, to try to find what you're capable of. And trying the same very specific movement over and over again, and training your body to be able to do that movement. It's about a personal challenge. There's no winning or losing, it's just about pushing yourself. 

Since I left New York City, I started spending more time outside. I would find myself in the woods, and there's no pavement out there. But in the same way that as a skater in the city you're constantly skating around and looking for spots, you're walking around the woods, and you see a little boulder and you think, “Can I climb that?” You just find these little places in the woods, these rock walls, or you hear about a climbing location and check it out, to see what you can do.

OT: You’ve been interning at Out There for the past few months. What drew you to storytelling? 

FW: The importance of storytelling is ingrained in me through my time in theater. Some of the first real theater experiences were a way for people to share stories. At the time, specifically religious stories, but that’s how people were educated back then. Before there was even common literacy, before people could even read, we were sharing stories. These stories that we put out there are more empathetic than the things that we learn in school, and empathy is the real teacher. So when we can share stories from people's personal lives, get a glimpse into people’s lives, we're learning a lot more from it than just the little tagline lesson that we'll put on to the end of an episode. We're learning about each other's lives, and we're learning how to see things differently. And that's really important.

OT: I know when it comes to being outside, we all have certain stories that we like to tell or that we think about a lot. How do you think we decide what stories kind of stick with us when it comes to nature and the outdoors?

FW: Well, I don't know if we decide, I think that nature influences us to make those realizations. The fact that we, as a podcast, get so many stories from the outdoors is just a testament to how powerful the outdoors are at giving us perspective about ourselves. Some of the greatest lessons that I've learned as an individual have been from my experiences outdoors, and just putting myself in an environment that isn't going to necessarily be the easiest environment to deal with. Trying to compare living in a tent to living in a well-furnished apartment, you recognize the things that we take for granted in society a little bit more. 

This interview has been edited for brevity and clarity.

You can find Forrest on Instagram.

Spotlight on Jennifer Daring

BY CARA SCHAEFER

Life is busy, but spending time outside can help us connect to both ourselves and others. We spoke with Jennifer Daring, leader of the Green Girl Gang, about work-life balance, creating community, and the impact of spending time with other women in the outdoors. 

Photos courtesy of Jennifer Daring.

OUT THERE: You've talked about having a never-ending list of hobbies. Why do you think that is? 

JENNIFER DARING: I'm curious and always interested in expanding and broadening my horizons. I just want to try everything at least one time!

OT: How do you manage your time in a way that allows you to get outside and do the things you're passionate about? 

JD: I currently work three jobs, go to school full-time, and run a women’s outdoor adventure group, so finding time for myself and my hobbies is something I’m still struggling with. But you know, I’m trying!

OT: Has anything in particular worked especially well for you when it comes to making sure you do get that time outside?

JD: Definitely saying no. I'm a yes person, so I say yes a lot. But I tend to overbook or bog myself down, when I really need to say no more. That way I can enjoy my hobbies and actually be present, and not just like, “Okay, get this done really quick so you can do the next thing”. 

OT:  You mentioned running a women's outdoor group. Can you give me the elevator pitch of what the Green Girl Gang is?

JD:  We are a women's focused outdoor group. Everyone is welcome, so if guys do want to show up, we're not going to single anybody out, but the focus is on women. We do everything and anything under the sun, like rock climbing, mountain biking, camping, backpacking, kayaking, stand up paddleboarding, and park cleanups. We get out there and help women find that community that they're looking for, versus, you know, being stuck in that cis white male community and not really connecting with people. 

OT: Do you have any intentional practices to try to make the atmosphere as welcoming as possible, especially for women who might not be familiar with certain outdoor activities, or maybe this is their first time in an outdoors group?

JD: I have newcomers pretty much at every meetup that we have! On my social media posts, I make it very clear that we all start somewhere, we're all not professionals, we all make mistakes, and we're all learning. It's all skill levels, from beginner to advanced. We want everyone to feel comfortable, whether it's their first time or their 20th time there.

OT: Is there any one memory in particular, when you think about the Green Girl Gang, that kind of encapsulates your experience with the group?

JD: Maybe my first or second meetup, we had a women's wellness festival. You had to buy a ticket in advance, and I bought mine the day of. I was still hesitant on whether I was going to attend or not, because it was a bunch of women that I didn't know, and I didn't know what I was getting myself into. I was terrified, but I was like, “You know what? I'm going to go. I’m going to do this and it's going to be a good time”. 

I went there, and it was a huge pivotal moment for me. I had the time of my life! I met amazing women who are my friends still to this day, and I got to try things I had never done before, like Buti yoga and slackline. It was a lot of fun just connecting and talking to women with different backgrounds and histories. I'm so glad I went.

OT: Are there any tips you would give someone looking to bring people together through the outdoors? 

JD: I have a friend who just moved to Colorado, and she was worried about finding her community. And I told her to make that community. Put up a flyer at the climbing gym. Have a conversation with someone on a hike. It's kind of scary at first, but just put yourself out there and create the community that you're looking for. 

This interview has been edited for brevity and clarity.

You can find Jennifer on Instagram and learn more about the Green Girl Gang online.

Spring Reflections

BY CARA SCHAEFER

Spring is a time of rejuvenation and new life. It can also be a time for reflection — on our lives, and our world. I asked Out There team members about the things that are bringing them joy, the ways they're experiencing growth at the moment, and things that they wish more people knew about. We hope you enjoy their responses, and we’d love to hear your thoughts on these questions!

OUT THERE: What outdoor images or memories do you associate with spring?

Tiffany Duong: Birds chirping. Kids running around in grass, playing and laughing. Sunshine.

 Forrest Wood: When I think of spring, I think of tiny leaves. I steward 24 acres of woodland in nowhere-northern New Jersey. The property has been in my family for four generations, and I’ve visited it in every season. Spring is a particularly wonderful time to be there. The tulips trees always wake up first. Their tiny leaves are so small and thin, practically translucent, but in just a few more weeks they will be massive leaves the size of your face. I see all these little leaves and the word that comes to mind is, “Potential”.

Jessica Taylor: Pollen, white flowers, bright new greens. Windows open. 

Willow Belden: When I lived on the East Coast, spring was my favorite season — full of crocuses, daffodils, budding trees, and the sweet smell of fresh air. Now that I live in Wyoming, “spring” doesn’t really exist; we go directly from winter to summer (last year, there was a snow storm as late as June). In Wyoming, spring means muddy trails, cold wind, and the drab remnants of dirty snow. But the bleak “shoulder season” makes summer that much sweeter when it finally does arrive.

OT: What’s one thing that is bringing you joy this season and why?

 Forrest: The list of things bringing me joy this season is not short, but the number one thing that I’m excited and grateful for is my second dose of Pfizer. My goodness, what a relief. I can't wait to play with my friends again. 

 Jessica: Getting out into nature and experiencing my first spring living on the East Coast. I love being close to the ocean and seeing the forest’s new growth right along its edge. It’s so beautiful and different. 

 Tiffany: Yoga by the sea – doing some "hippie" full moon ceremonies feels really cleansing, and it's nice to think you get a restart every month. 

Sheeba: My little niece is 18 months, and though this is not her first spring, she is more vocal and aware this year than last year. A few weeks ago, my mom and I showed her how to plant a seed. When the seed started to bloom, and she recognized it as the one we planted together, she got super excited! She now asks us in her own little ways to see the plant, which is growing bigger each day. It's fun to see the excitement of plants and birds and butterflies, all the sweet memories of spring, from the amazement of a little one!

 Cara: Watching my cat play with popsicle sticks (or really do anything). He’s a tiny tyrant, but also very cute. 

Photos courtesy of FoRRest Wood.

 OT: Spring can often symbolize rejuvenation or growth. How is that showing up in your own life right now?

 Forrest: One major aspect of growth in my life right now is my choice not to return to the seasonal summer job I’ve had for the past few years. It’s a little scary not to have a paying job on the horizon, but I’m committing time to finish the first drafts of two books I’ve been in the process of writing this past year. Writing has always been something I’ve done in my free time, but now I’m really trying to cultivate self-discipline and motivation towards a writing career. This commitment will hopefully be a big step towards becoming the person I want to be.

Jessica: With my largest client leaving me without notice or reason, I have been left empty handed and I had to let my team go. Although this is a tough season, I still am so thankful it’s coming during the spring when I am reminded that things have to die in order to be made new, just like how we see leaves fall and come back with new life.

Tiffany: I've had a ton of new opportunities show up at my door that are exciting, scary, and overwhelming. In order to do right by them – and myself – I'm being forced to let go of what doesn't fully serve me in my life (people, jobs, etc.). Letting go with grace is not a skill I have mastered yet, so I'm growing through that.

 Cara: As both a chronic people pleaser and overachiever, I’ve always struggled with setting boundaries when it comes to work. Especially when those boundaries might inconvenience someone else. With leading Saturday interpretive hikes and helping with special events, I’ve found that I’m sometimes working every day of the week…which doesn’t feel great to be honest. So this week I finally asked for a few Mondays off to make up for weekend work hours. Meetings will have to be moved, people will possibly be displeased, but I need to create that space for myself.

OT: What’s one thing you want more people to know about? 

 Forrest: A word that should be a part of everyone's vocabulary : Mycorrhiza (My-core-riz-ah) — The symbiotic paring of fungus and root. We once thought that a forest was a collection of plants and animals all competing for sunlight and nutrients. Modern science has proven otherwise. Forests are cooperative, trees of different species can share nutrients through vast underground networks of symbiotic fungi. Trees trade sugars to bacteria within the fungi, who mine minerals from rocks that tree roots themselves cannot penetrate. All of that trading happens within the thin, filamentous structure of the fungi, collectively called mycelium. All of this information is creating a new type of forest management called Mycoforestry - which directly encourages healthy ecosystems by highlighting the importance of soil health, and supporting mycorrhizal growth.

Jessica: Jasmine Star Show Podcast and Crush the Rush Podcast. Both are women business owners that are rocking the marketing/business/life support category. I always learn and have something actionable to do after I listen to them. 

Tiffany: That we really do only have about 10 years to save the environment. It sounds doomsday and crazy, but that's where we are. We are the last hope for our way of life and our planet as we know it.

Willow: The book Braiding Sweetgrass, by Robin Wall Kimmerer. It’s a love letter to the natural world, and a fascinating inside look at the ways in which science and indigenous wisdom complement each other. If you think (as I used to) that human activities are unequivocally bad for the environment — that sustainability means minimizing harm (rather than actively doing good) — read this book. If it seems preposterous to suggest that the natural world could, in some instances, be better off because of human interactions — read this book. If you seek an understanding of your place in the world that transcends the boundaries of art, science, or spirituality — read this book. It has already changed me for the better.

Cara: Go outside today and try to find one new thing. It will lead you to wonder. 

Answers have been edited for brevity and clarity.

Spotlight on Camille Verendia

BY CARA SCHAEFER

How do you take a golf course and turn it back into a natural environment? To answer this, we spoke with Camille Verendia, a Wetland Restoration Technician at the Truckee Meadows Parks Foundation, about wetlands and ecological restoration. 

Photo courtesy of Camille Verendia.

OUT THERE: Why are wetlands important to our environment?

CAMILLE VERENDIA: Wetlands are amazing and underrated! First of all, they provide habitat to so many species, including one-third of birds and one-sixth of mammals listed as threatened or endangered in the United States. They’re a huge wildlife hotspot. Wetlands also help filter water for purification, which is great for the communities around us, and they sequester more carbon than rainforests do. They also have cultural significance. Native American tribes used a lot of the plant species such as cattail for food and building material. Coyote willows, which grow frequently in our wetlands, can be used for making baskets. 

OT: What made you want to go into ecological restoration work?

CV: I think it has a lot to do with my childhood and how I was brought up. We weren’t the wealthiest, so for our family vacation, instead of going to fancy places, we would just go camping every summer. That instilled in me a need to protect the environment, and a reverence for it. I love different ecosystems and learning about environmental science. Also, I knew from early on that I didn’t want to have a job where I’m in an office from nine to five. I want a job where I can be out in the environment and engage with it more deeply, as opposed to just taking a walk or a hike. You can still engage with the environment in that way, but I wanted to actually know how the ecosystem functions. 

OT: What does it take exactly to restore land altered by humans back into a more natural state?

CV: One thing that I believe about restoration is that you can never really restore it back to its original state, because of the damage that’s already been done, but you can always make an effort to make it as close to its original state as possible. 

It involves a lot of invasive-species removal. So on our wetland we have a lot of invasive whitetop, kochia, and tamarisk. They are extremely difficult to remove, especially whitetop, because they have a really deep root system. 

It also entails a lot of planting, so in the spring and fall we’ll try to plant native plants. Unfortunately, the success rate for that is not the highest, but it’s still important to try to integrate native plants as much as possible into this environment. That’s what was there before it was a golf course, and that’s probably one of our best shots at restoring it back to its natural state. 

OT:  I feel like it’s a lot of persistent effort.

CV: It’s definitely easy to lose track of the big picture when you’re doing restoration. If you have this huge property that’s over 200 acres, and you just are able to pull weeds on one acre for a day, it can feel kind of overwhelming. It’s a lot of digging and manual labor. The land will be improved, but there’s always work to do.

OT: Is there anything you’ve found especially surprising or amusing about your job so far?

CV: One thing is that restoration is a very long, ongoing process. Our project started two years ago, and it’s going to keep continuing forever and ever because restoration never really ends.

As for amusing, things break all the time. Literally, probably every week or two some piece of equipment breaks, and it’s just sort of working with it and learning how to work around it. When we were building fences our auger broke. Without it, we had to dig the holes from scratch!

OT: So let’s say you visit the property twenty years from now, what would you hope to see?

CV: I always think about when I have kids, I want to bring them back here and be like, “This is what I did when I just graduated college. and look where it is now.” I would hope to see a lot more native plants, and it would be cool to see some unique bird species utilizing our wetlands.

OT: Considering how much time you’ve spent out in the wetlands the last couple months, how has your connection or relationship to the land changed?

CV: I just feel more at home. If I look back to when I first started, I knew basically nothing. I mean, I knew what wetlands were, and common restoration practices, but I feel like now I have a much more thorough understanding of the land. It’s cool to know a place so well. 

Also, when you work on something on a deep level like this, there’s this sense of ownership and pride in what you’re doing. It’s made me more eager to restore it. I’m very proud of the work that we’ve done, and I want to share it with the world.

This interview has been edited for brevity and clarity.

You can learn more about the Truckee Meadows Parks Foundation and support their wetland restoration project at their website.